What It Really Takes to Build a Business in Indianapolis | Roots Roundtable 01

Welcome back to the Roots Podcast. I'm Max Moore and today we have a special episode. We're stepping out of our normal flow where we're talking to these big property owners that own 50,000 units and we're changing up. We're going to the machine that runs roots on the agency side. Got the founder agents here. We just wanted to switch up the pace. This episode is directly for all of our listeners, but specifically somebody that wants to take a leap in entrepreneurship, but doesn't know how to get started. These guys have done it. They've jumped into the deep end. they've drowned a little bit and they found a way to get above water and start crushing it. And honestly, there's my friends that I get to do business with every day. So, I want to share that with you because I think our team is special what we get to do and how we get to have this like community and culture and I just want to share that with our audience. So, without further ado, welcome to the show, boys. Let's rock and roll. Thanks, bro. I want to kick things off with just directing over to Trent. Trent Kiester. How did you get into real estate? Um, well, I got into real estate because of Tyler, who's not here today. Um, but I, uh, I was in college and I wasn't really enjoying my experience at IU and I, uh, had always wanted to be a business owner. And so, the idea of like owning a piece of real estate that I could live in and rent out to a piece of it to one of my buddies, uh, was really exciting for me. And so, I um, I found Tyler on Bigger Pockets and he helped me buy my first house hack when I was in college. And that was kind of my my gateway into into real estate. Yeah. direct drug of how can we invest and build wealth and get there. Kyle, talk about your transition. I know we have a whole episode on how you did that, but how did you become an agent? Yeah, that I guess the fast track was I was a teacher at the time back in 2023 and was looking for an exit because I needed to make more money. That was truthfully the the motor behind making a decision in a different direction. Um, I've known Tyler for a long time and I knew he was had recently made his switch from education into real estate and so was curious of what that looked like. So, just got a uh got the FC Tucker School uh you know, it was like 30 days uh to get my license. Really had no big plans at all uh going into it. It was just like, hey, let's just see see how this goes. Do it part-time for a school year uh and see if this is a direction I can head in. and uh ended up really enjoying it. A lot of the the skills that I was able to build as a teacher in education like seamlessly went into becoming an agent. You do a lot of advising, you know, planning and making sure that you're kind of walking people through a difficult process and being able to clear the way for them to make a a clear decision. Um, and so yeah, did it part-time for 10 months and then made the leap full-time at the the end of the 2024 school year and the rest is history. So, I'm actually kind of curious. You've known Tyler the longest. Can you just give a like one little glimpse of what Tyler is like back in either the college day, like how, first of all, how long have you known him? And just give us one little tidbit of what give us some info on Tyler. I think I think I've known Tyler since I was like 16. Okay. Uh we I met him through like church stuff. He went to Westside Church of the Nazarene and I went to a very small Nazarene church on the northeast side in Castleton. So we'd partner up for like youth group stuff. Uh so met him through that but didn't really get to know him super well until college and we were roommates. Um he he's interesting. He's always been uh he's always been a person that kind of goes his own way. M um and you know I think that is kind of bleeding through into what he's been able to do uh as an as an entrepreneur. Um but he uh the thing that I I always think of most when I think of Tyler is he's he's a guy that like he doesn't have a filter really, [laughter] you know, and I think there's there's pros and cons to that. Um makes him a great podcast host. [laughter] Yeah. I mean, it's like, you know, there's there's not too much of a filter with like what you see is what you get um when when you get in interactions with him. So, true. But true. Yeah. I went to UPUY and was graduating in the winter of 2019. I was a junior. I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I was triple majoring, had a minor, I was in the honors college doing the school thing. And I was like, what am I doing at four? So, I kind of put together a list of like, okay, here's what I want in a in a job, in a career. Like, I want freedom and impact. And what I one of the things was I I wanted to not have a really a limit on what my work could bring to me. I've just saw a lot of my friends have internships and jobs where they would work really hard, but, you know, doesn't matter if they worked harder than the next person, they're making the same amount of money. I'm not money driven, but I'm like, I don't want to have that limitation on me. walked through a house that had been flipped by my girlfriend's dad at the time. And it was just like in that moment, oh, you know, you could buy something for x amount in this amount of time. You sell it, you make this money, and you make the neighborhood better because it was in my hometown. Like, this house was crap. Turn it into something beautiful, an actual home for someone. So for the first year and a half, I did investing real estate of from the whole nine yards from rental management, putting on the lock boxes, doing rental photography, moveout inspections to sourcing deals to creating budgets for flips for managing those flips and then helping either sell them or lease them out. Um, so I saw the whole gambit and it wasn't until I got into my first residential solo deal, which is my cousins. They moved from Minnesota to Indianapolis, helping them buy their first home. I was like, "Ah, it's great helping a California investor that I don't know who they are make 50 grand." Helping someone close to me buy their home, their first home specifically. Impact that's that brought me to light. And so really the past kind of 4 and a halfish years of my career has been focused on okay, how can I get people from renting in Indianapolis to buying a home in the simplest way with the most confidence with a real plan and I've just dedicated my career to building that out. So yeah, I love that. I think you also got connected to Roots through Tyler. So just listen to all of you guys talk. Yeah, everybody's been connected and that's been he's been the conduit to pull us. Yeah, I met Tyler when he first joined the industry. Um, and then when he met you, I' I've been able to watch the growth, have conversations from the beginning with you guys. It's been really cool. It's been awesome. Sweet. Where we're where I was thinking uh on the drive over agency is such a unique thing because it is almost like a sandbox that you can play in and a career aspect. How have you been able to take that just like blank slate and mold it into a lifestyle that you actually want? Anybody? That's a big question, huh? I think it's really weird coming from a W2 job entering into it where some of you guys have different situations that were not like by the book. Like I was going by the book, went to college, got the job, did did it for seven years. Um, so when I jumped into it, it was like a lot more shocking of like I don't know what to do. Wait, I can do things however I want. uh there's really no guardrails in terms of like how I do my business, who I do business with, all of that stuff uh was just crazy from the get-go. So, for me, it was a lot of trial and error and figuring out what am I what am I good at, what do I enjoy doing, what do I not enjoy doing, what do I not like doing, and then trying to weave through that to figure out what the path forward is. Um, and I don't have it all figured out yet either. Um, but I think we've discussed this in the past. I was like, it's really cool working in real estate, working as an entrepreneur where you literally get to create the the culture of your business and how you want to do that. And that's something that, you know, 95% of people don't have that ability to do. Like even even as a school teacher, I at least could control my classroom, right? I at least could say, "Okay, within these four walls, I can control what goes on here and kind of the the vibe that we're going to have here." As a business owner, you know, you get to do that all the time. So, um, yeah. Yeah. I think unique ability is something that comes up in my brain. It's like if you can identify what you're uniquely great at and you can just do that, it's usually like what brings you the most joy and freedom. And probably on the end of that is like impact. It's like discovering what your unique ability is. For me, I like I love building systems and I love hosting conversations that like make people think bigger. Whether that's with a client, a first-time home buyer, oh, I can't buy a house. Well, maybe you can and let's talk about and let's ask some questions around that. Um, or if it's an agency, it's like if you can just hone in on your direct skill set, the world is completely your playground at that point. But it's hard to get to that. Yeah. Because on the like flip end of that, there's you could just be lost all day long and have no idea what to do and you're staring at a computer and you're thinking that you're doing work just by updating your LinkedIn profile for the seventh time over going and like walking homes trim. What was the like what structure did you need to become I'm I'm happy you asked that question because that's exactly what I was going to get to was like I'm very much a person that needs structure. So like um the uh the idea of like you know being able to clock in at a certain time and clock out at a certain time that kind of like helped my brain always work like whenever I was at back nine doing whatever I was doing there. And so coming from something like that where you do have rigid structure to your point moving into a a role where you get to create that structure is difficult for me. And so, um, I leaned on you a lot. Like, that's exactly what I did is like I'm like, "Well, I don't I don't really know what I should be doing, so like, let me ask Max, like let me help let me, uh, let me let Max help me craft my day." Um, and so that was like the very pivotal thing for me was not copy and pasting your business, but, um, being in a room with you on a daily basis and learning how you moved was really important for me. So, I love that. go back to college, Ian. And you see the house, it's been flipped. It's beautiful. And this impact is driven. Like, how has that set up the last seven years of your business? You're like a 10-year agent compared to all of us. Yeah. I I didn't I think what's nice is I've never really experienced what it was like to make a regular paycheck. Um, and it feels like every February, March, when no money's coming in, I'm like, well, maybe I should have taken a nineto-ive job. It would have been nice to have some security. I saw like the application to Walmart [laughter] before. Yeah. No, it's it's tempting sometimes. I will say it's it's not easy being an agent. I think what a lot of people outside of the industry don't understand is how difficult it is to make a consistent living. Um, and I think that for me has the the best thing that that has done for me is is made me reliant on the Lord's provision and understanding where things come from. that money is a gift to us. It's not something that is ours. And I I think I have a natural proclivity towards pride and thinking that my work is achieving things. And there's a level of importance of having good labor and being excellent in your craft that I think is important to pursue. But because of all I've known is commission and often times I know Kyle and I talked a lot about this last year. Sometimes business just comes to me and I'm like, I don't feel like this is deserved in a way. Like I don't know where this came from. And for me, that's just been an easy way of just being surrendering my my work life and my finances to the Lord. The structure piece, I think, is huge. I've been on five different teams in my seven-year career, five different companies. Um, in some ways, I'm like, man, that's that kind of sucks to say that. I don't like the fact that I moved around a lot. But what I've been able to learn by being on so many different places, the way that different brokerages and teams and agents operate, getting to learn from some incredible people, amazingly talented teams and brokerages, is like now that I'm at Roots, I've seen what we do well. First and foremost, the culture that we're building is absolutely extraordinary. But on a weekly basis, Max and Tyler are bringing a level of education and training that most people would pay thousands and thousands of dollars for for a week long. You know, go to some seminar and learn this. And we learn it on a weekly basis. And I don't think that value is appreciated enough in our industry, especially like if you're if you're a newer agent. And so, I just want to commend the team and what we've been able to build of like, hey, this is this is gold. And a lot of it whether it's business structure even involving the fact that hey as an agent our business is our life right like we are our business at the end of that we were talking about this yesterday like at the end of the day wherever you're at like you have to be your own business and I think what roots does extraordinarily well is allows that to be easier there's a clear pathway for that and a clear training for that and a lot of camaraderie going through that together um which is more valuable than you can really put a number on in my opinion So yeah, I don't think often enough on the podcast we talk about like where Roots is at currently. We're sitting 15 16 agents. Uh have a few full-time employees like have really really grown to the word 10x. Like I think we've 100x since 2023 from what we were doing. And it's not stopping there. What are you guys most like fired up about in the direction that we're headed at Roots? We can I mean we can share full disclosure any three to five year goals that we've talked about. I'd love to air them out because telling people about them is exactly how they become true. What are you guys fired up about? I'll go first. The I mean the the one of their main goals is the thousand first-time home buyers by 2032 5-year timeline. Uh that for me I mean that's that's my business is first-time home buyers getting people out of renting and into owning. Average age is 40 years old. We're kind of familiar with the stats. It's like it's harder and harder and harder to buy a home. It's getting more and more expensive. Those interest rates are not dropping back down to 3%. I'm sorry. Like, it's just it's difficult to get into home ownership. Um, even if you really want it. And so, that goal for me is pivotal because that's where I focus my business. And it it starts with like you have to have a team that's providing something that makes that possible. And I think Roots does a fantastic job of introducing people to different ways of doing that. I think what Kyle's doing with his house hack focus is absolutely crucial. Like if you're in a stage of life where you're like wanting to buy a house and you're open to flexible options, I think house hacking is a fantastic way to explore that and you know Kyle's the guy for that. So we have these different pieces of our team to make that possible. That's what gets me excited. Everyone has their niche. Yeah. And we really niched down in the beginning with investment because that's what we were interested in. I mean, like Trent was talking about, his first home was an investment to get into real estate. That's how he became an agent. That's how I became an agent. That's how Tyler became an agent. And so, a lot of times, my favorite question to ask somebody is like, "What do you think our mix is investor to like retail?" And I'd blow everybody's mind to when the scale is tilted more to that retail and even more so like 30% of our transactions are first-time home buyers. And we're bringing that average age. Like, there has not been a first-time home buyer yet that we've helped close that is over the age of 40. Correct. Like we are bringing that down and in fact we're we're helping a lot of them close with less than five grand down like in a in a lot of unique ways. It's been a lot of fun. Some some zero get a check at closing. Been there. Some get a [laughter] check. Yeah. What are you guys fired up about? I think for me I really like the culture building aspect which I never anticipated coming from you know being an entrepreneur number one but just like a real estate team. It was like okay what kind of impact can we have to better the city of Indianapolis get people excited about being Hoosiers being people who are residents in Indianapolis. Like just for starters, it was like the street sweep thing that we started last year and then have kind of carried the torch into this year. Like that'sundred people are going to come to the streets. Yeah. And it was crazy. And I did I you know when we were doing it in uh July on July 7th I was at Garfield Park and talking with some of the people. It was like, "Okay, hey, how'd you hear about this? Like how did you show up here today?" And uh like one of the the girls I was talking with, she's like, "Oh, I saw it on TikTok." I was like, "This is just wild." Like, this is one of those things where it's like, I send out to friends and family and they come and show up support. Like, that's that was what I anticipated. But to have a a totally like cold reachout on social media at a random trash bag to like start in Garfield Park, which is not like, you know, top of the most people are like, I don't even know where Garfield Park is. Uh, for them to show up, like I thought that was really cool. And for her, it wasn't even like I don't even think she put two and two together. It was like, "Oh, this is a real estate team that put this on." Yeah. And it didn't have to be that. And I and I loved that. So, um yeah, just the the community impact that I think that we can have is probably going to be the most fulfilling aspect uh with our trajectory and where we're going. Well, and one of the reasons why we do hit on investment so much is because so much of our city is owned by investors. And so to me, I'm like, if we can change the way that a landlord, a landlord is helping their tenant and like taking care of their tenant in that property, like that is going to have a serial impact on the way that our city looks. And I've learned over the last year, like with Streets, we've had an ambitious goal, 777 hooers to come out on July 7th of 2026 to pick up trash. And we hit 400, which is off the charts better than I thought that we would actually do. Some nights I was like, man, we're going to have like five at each park. It was going to be an awkward experience. And now I'm like more fired up than ever to go after, you know, 1,777 on July 17th of 27 industries. com. We already have signups open up ready to go, which I believe is a Saturday and not a Tuesday, which also should make it. You don't have to call off work. You can just come out and and pick up trash with us. And so like that that community aspect has been a lot of fun. Like we're supposed to sell real estate and all of a sudden we're building like true community through social and some of the stuff and work that you guys are doing. It's been a blast. uh being able to champion that. I love it. I'm going to keep doing it. What What's got you fired up, Trent? Yeah, I think for me, and my answer to this question has I think changed quite a bit over the last couple of years, but I think right now I'm most excited about helping our newer agents get better. Like I think when I look when I analyze what's happened in my own life, in my own business over the last couple years, I can attribute the overwhelming majority of it to being around people that were doing the thing that I wanted to do at a much higher level than I was able to do it at at that time. And so, um, being in a position now where I know more, where, um, I've closed a couple of deals and helped every kind of client do every kind of deal, um, I'm I'm excited to be in a position to share that knowledge with others. Um, and stepping into like kind of like that education role, um, that I've never been able to to be in before. So, that's something I'm excited about. Yeah, it's awesome to see you do some of that uh, work just like people giving back and like, dude, Trent, help me with this. It was awesome to sit down with me. Blew my mind. And then Trent's like, I suck at teaching, bro. People learn from you every single day. It's It's nuts. What do you guys think? What do you What would be a miss in 5 years if we're like chasing after a dream of of building? What would be a miss if we didn't hit keeping the main thing the main thing I think the the biggest thing to understand in life is that it is temporary and it's also not ours and everything that we're given to whom much is given much is expected. So for me, the biggest miss would be not giving glory to the father, not giving glory to the one that's given this opportunity, which is a big piece of the street sweep and the community building and and training other people and even getting people into their first home. It's like we want to do these things often times not because it's a direct benefit to us, but that we are able to give back. And that just has to come from a heart of open-handedness. Um, and I know at least for me personally, I can't speak for these guys, but that oftentimes is difficult and doesn't come naturally. So, it's a constant like reflection and reliance on like, hey, this is something that I have to ask the Lord for help to do. Um, you know, there there's a lot of I think business answers that I think these guys are going to have better answers for, but for me personally, it's like, man, if we're not if we're not opening the kingdom to more people, saying the name of Jesus out loud, and boldly proclaiming the truth, um, I think we're missing the point. And you know, if I make twice as much money, if I gain the world but lose my soul, what's the purpose? And I think that perspective on a teamwide, on an impact wide is would be a would absolutely be a big mess for sure. All of that I think uh for me like it's when you're trying to kind of build something, I always think of like bigger and better, right? Um and sometimes you get really swept up with the bigger and not the better part. Great idea. And so I I could even think of that just from like me doing transactions. It's like I'm setting goals for every year and it's like okay well next year I'm going to do 40 transactions and it's like okay well should I be more focused on that as an indicator or should I be focused on the transactions that I do have the ability to do and like the privilege of running. Are they perfect transactions to the best of my ability for both buyer and seller? Right? Uh so if we're just looking at it from that through that lens and then from like a broader roots lens it's I I think of it in the same way. It's like okay what are the ways that we can steward better for like our resources and our our time our talent our treasure to our community and then what opportunities as Trent was kind of saying can we present for people who want to get into the entrepreneurial space who want to become agents and become entrepreneurs and have that abundance mentality to say hey we have enough resources there's enough people that we can do business with here and we can build it the right way. uh the better way, not necessarily always the bigger way. Uh and yeah, I think kind of what you're saying is like trust God's timing, trust God's provision that if we're doing the right things, you know, God will bless that um and he will continue providing you know so long as we are kind of you know aligning with his will because you know what God gives God can also take away too. So uh just always being mindful of that. Yeah, God's [clears throat] been active in this business, keeping the main thing the main thing, having some excellence throughout, and it's so fun to just like he just shows up in all the right spaces when we need him. I was going to say I'll keep my answer short because you guys nailed literally both of the things that I was thinking. I I think it would be a miss um for Roots uh as a company if we did not continue to try to increase our reach. Um, and I think for a long time like we were having discussions about like well like you know should we really grow? Like do we want to bring on new agents? Is that the right idea? And I think what does growth look like? Right. What is [laughter] my goodness that question has been asked a million times? But to your point, right, it's like growth is uh only good so long as you are growing and getting better, right? And so I think um you know if we're doing both those things, we're we're doing well. Yeah. Yeah, I think in like the Hermosi sense, if you're going to build a skyscraper, you have to build that foundation as deep as it is tall. And it's like, hey, we're still digging and we're still in a season of digging right now. And that's okay. And like as times pressure comes, and that is exactly how a diamond is made. So like roots will be under that pressure for as long as like the kingdom is going to be shaken by the effect of a real estate team that's not just for profit and like on mission. Uh, I don't know if I've ever heard of one that comes with the same values that that we do, which is like that's what fires me up the most. Uh, so in that like we have to do all three of those things in the next five to like take over the world and and or take over little tiny part of Indianapolis. I I don't we'll see what it becomes. I feel like I've been building the foundation of my business every single year. I don't know about how you guys feel about business building in general, but like for me it's like, okay, you know, when you get to the end of the year, you're at a a time when things slow down, it's like, okay, go back to the foundations. Am I doing the most basic things? You set your goals and you're like, all right, next year I've got this figured out. [laughter] It's I'm going to crush. It's like, oh man, I Yeah, it is interesting. It's always it's always going back to the foundation. Is the foundation stable? Well, let's talk about that as like an entrepreneur in those darker times when it's like money's pressed, there's not clients coming in. Like what pulls you guys out of it? For me, it's being around other people to be honest because first part of this year I was taking L's like dude like trust me it was January through Mar or January through May I was like all right I guess is my license to teach still good? Like it was it was I was going through it. So for anybody who looks and sees sees the just pended whatever like it doesn't tell the full story like I was really going through it and I had to kind of look back at I had to backtrack 6 months nine months and say okay what led me here and you know what do I need to adjust in my business to where that doesn't happen again. The reality is there are certain things we just can't control and so you know part of that again trusting God's provision. Uh but a real part of that too is like there were things that I look back I'm like ah I was missing the mark here. So like for me it was like okay I wasn't taking intake calls for me uh for investors. I was like okay I got to start doing that. Um I was so narrowly focused on you know one part of the business but not the comprehensive part. And so you get caught up in transactions and then when those close out I was like I don't I don't have anything else in the pipeline. And so that was a real a real struggle at the first part. But what kept me going coincidentally, you think it wouldn't because you see all these other people crushing and you're like, "Meep, I [laughter] I've made, you know, no dollars for a few months here." Uh, but I think with our team, with our mission, you know, we have the abundance mindset. There are people that are willing to go in and say, "Okay, here's an opportunity." I can speak to Ian firsthand. Literally, he's been gracious enough to bring me aboard on some of his transactions or to say, "Hey, here's a lead. Like, I trust you with them. I think you're actually going to be the perfect fit fit for this. And in a time of need, he's saying, "Hey, I'm willing to, you know, give you a piece of the pie to go run this thing." Um, that's a huge blessing. And I don't think that's something number one, you won't get that as a solo agent at all. You're going to be going through it. You're in your own head and that's going to be a really rough place to be. Uh, but then, you know, I can't I can't speak to other teams. This is all I've been a part of. Obviously, Ian, you've been a part of other teams, but um I don't I can't imagine that that is super common place in our industry. So, yeah, it's it's special. And I one of the [clears throat] things that like was a core principle that you learned in that time is like this 90day rearview mirror in this business as an agent. I talk about it a lot now because I'm like, "Oh man, I missed that with Kyle." There was like a 90-day period where Kyle was just crushing deals constantly and as a result, he got very busy. So then the system started to lack on like new intake to continue to build business up and like complacent is not the right word because Kyle's a dog and he's always hungry. He was getting deals closed. And so then he gets into this season of like 90 days of lapse because there wasn't intake going on and new leads coming in and we're in a transitional page and roots where I'm like stepping out of transactions. It was just missed. And then now like you're consistently doing the thing and you know that those reps are important and it's been cool to see you kind of climb out of that. Yeah. Thanks for sharing. And it was awesome. Yeah. I think um in my experience and I think this will be different than maybe what you'll end up sharing just because of the nature of where our business comes from. Um but but I've found typically when I've had struggle months, it's not been because um there weren't people to serve. It was more because of bad transactional luck or uh or you know like just the need to release from a transaction. Sometimes listings have to mutually released twice to get it sold once or three times or to the right buyer. Max is hoping that's true all the time. I'm hoping that's true with a massive deal that is going on. [laughter] Um so but anyways what I always fall back on I think is there is such an abundance of um there there's an abundance of people that want to buy houses [laughter] uh and and uh and we we our marketing is good enough and and we serve people well enough to where those people show up. Right. You talked about this earlier and this is something I talk to the new agents about all the time which is like at some point like once you are in this long enough the people just start to show up and it's it's kind of hard to uh like say exactly where they came from but that's just kind of how it feels is like I I I'm never necessarily worried about not having the next person in terms of like somebody to go help buy a house. Uh it's more just um bad transactional luck sometimes I think in my experience in the bad months. That's true. But again, for somebody like you, like I take a lot of leads, right? Like I don't generate as much business as you. And so for somebody that like relies on on that a lot, like I'm sure that feels a different it's miserable. I mean that there's been it feels like every year there's at least one or two times a year where I'm legitimately like is this what I should still be doing? Like I have a wife, I have a kid, like I need to provide. Is this real provision? Is that part of the job or do you feel like it's just, you know, the the stats are crazy? I mean, if you haven't heard this before, it's, you know, only 13% of agents last in the first 5 years, like past 5 years. And the stats on how many agents, I mean, what is it? Six, 65 or 70% of agents last year didn't do any deals at all or just did one or fewer. Like, it is really, really hard to make a living as an agent. For me personally, my focus is I want to help primary residential buyers and sellers. My niche focus is first-time home buyers because that's what I'm passionate about. But like let's say I do, you know, my friend that's finally wanting to buy a house. You know, we've been thinking about it for a couple of years. We've been planning, we build, he buys a house. Okay, great. That paycheck, awesome. That covers a month, maybe two months of expenses. Fantastic. But they're not making another deal for five, seven, 10 years possibly. They're not making another move. So finding consistency as a traditional agent with your own sphere worth of deals or even just generating leads yourself is extremely difficult. And I always I've had many people tell me, "Hey, I'm thinking about becoming an agent and all this stuff." If you're doing it because your perception is there's a lot of money to be made, fine. But don't do it because of that. And like when I talk to people about wanting to buy a house, for example, my core question is always why? What is driving you to make a move? What is driving you to put yourself in a financial position where you're spending a ton of money? You're committing a lot of time, energy, and resources to this one thing. Because when it's difficult, when you're going through the inspection phase and you're like, "Oh crap, I'm making a mistake." When you have that buyer's remorse, like you have to fall back on something deeper than I just think it would be cool to own a home. I think it's kind of the same thing as an agent. If you're wanting to become an agent, you have to know like what is your actual motivation for doing this? Like if you're doing something solely for money, that's that's perfectly fine. And I know a lot of agents that do that and they make a ton of money, but that's not going to last and bring you joy when times are difficult. When the deals aren't, you're going to be at the mercy of the roller coaster. Correct. And and it's been even as someone that doesn't care about the money, probably fifth or sixth on my priority list, it's still difficult because the provision piece is is a real thing. So I think you know the answer for me is you know thank goodness I have a relationship with Jesus and now a team that I can help just be like help me and I can at least talk to somebody about it. Being a solo agent like I have in the past not on a team on different brokerages like being an agent can really suck a lot of times. It's not sunshine and rainbows. And I think the beautiful part about our team is the community that we're building within the team. And like we have so many quality people that are grounded in reality that understand the trials that can come our way that we can just reach out to and talk to, grab a cup of coffee with, shoot a text, have a quick call to ground you in that. That's invaluable. That's worth any sort of percentage that you can pay. Cuz like your point, I have experienced a lot of different places and this is legit. It's not just a facade. there there's depth to what we're building and they think that foundation is what's going to carry us beyond where we're at for sure. Yeah, I love that. So, we'll just clip that as the infomercial for why [laughter] become an agent. That's actually more of why not to become an agent because like seriously it is not easy in this industry too. I think it's a beautiful piece about what we provide though too like the fact that we have the opportunity to have consistent business. The the best piece of advice I got when I was a younger agent was don't join a team because they're promising you leads. This is the first thing that I've been a part of where I'm like there's actually some legit like there's there's real truth behind that. Like the reason they say don't do that is because most of the time [laughter] the the owner of that team are taking the leads. They're executing them. They're closing them from Zillow or they have this special script that just gets them through that no pseudo agents can be able to learn. But like I mean dude at Roots it's like it's like 10 calendar invites a week. business that we like it's opportunities to learn. It's unbelievable. Yeah. Yeah. And and that's been kind of the the cornerstone is like a lot of those leads are a treadmill to build up to getting a personal brand to starting to take over different relational things because it's a relational game and sometimes you need a little bit of accelerant in that that relation to to get going. Um [clears throat] you guys are all Indianapolis buffs. What do you guys think if if you had you could afford a $300,000 house and you're optimizing for just appreciation purely? This could be for a primary resident, could be for a tenant, uh to be, you know, for a landlord or for an investor client to be buying. What neighborhood are you going? $300,000 appreciation. Where are you parking that money? I got an answer. It's more of a risk though. It's like I'm taking I view appreciation two different ways. there's appreciation from like a oh this is a steady tried and true neighborhood. Yeah. Three, four, five% or I take the hey this has a lot of boom potential. Uh if I have 300,000 maybe I'm buying in Garfield Park personally. Um I like the direction it's moving in. I don't know if it's a five, a 10, or a 15 year time horizon, but um yeah, I really like the direction it's moving in. Uh Cammy, Contemporary Art Museum of Indianapolis just opened up in May. um pretty state-of-the-art. Like many millions of dollars has gone into this and um [snorts] it's been really cool to see kind of that take off. Helm Coffee is in there uh not at Cammy but in the neighborhood. Um, I think Big Lug, they have a new kind of like pizza bar joint uh down that way, too, which is really cool, which coincidentally are open every single day and have business, which cannot be said for a lot of downtown restaurants. There are downtown restaurants that are not open like Monday, Tuesday, like because they don't get the business. They're open every day. They also have a killer lunch special. Um [laughter] $9. 99 you get a personal pan pizza, a salad, and a drink. Sounds like he knows this. Okay. In those rough months, that's where he was eating. They're open just for Kyle. [laughter] In 300,000, you can get a lot in Garfield Park for 300,000. You could get a single family home. That's Dude, I sold a like five bed, three bath there last year in Garfield for 321. Wow. Wow. If there you could house hack a duplex. There's been some money duplexes in and around that area. So, yeah, Garfield Park's my pick. That's sick. A lot of green space, commercial on the rise. There's a lot going on there. Yeah, I've I've got a bunch of answers. Um I Well, give us the best one. Well, I'm going to give you a couple, but I'll make them all short. Um, you're cheating. If I was if I was gonna if I needed to buy something tomorrow, I would buy the most cookie cutter threebedroom, twob single family ranch in Brownsburg as I could possibly find, right? Get me a brick ranch with a twocar attached garage in a fencing backyard and I'll put a tenant in it and it will be an amazing investment. That will be 15 years. It'll be amazing. It'll be in my backyard. I'll be able to manage it. It'll be awesome. Um, so that would be what I would buy personally. Um, if I needed to stay like downtown, um, there are a couple different areas I would think about. One that I I I don't ever hear people talk about this neighborhood and it blows my mind is Christmas Addicts. It is um, just right there south of Riverside on the north side of Indie. Like literally step out your door, stare at the new billion-dollar IU Health Development type location. It's unbelievable. Um, and we've helped people buy single family homes in there for anywhere from like 180 to 230, 240. Um, and I just think like locationwise, um, what you get for your money there is insane. I'm also biased towards South Riverside, which is just right there as well. It's where I did my first little house hack. And, um, every time we do our master class at Googman, I'm like, what the heck? Like the real estate over here is not expensive. So nice. And I was just bashing Trent two years ago, maybe on like intro calls. He's like, I'm telling you about this place that's going to come up and I'm like, bro, I think he's drunk. Like, but now we drive through it. And I'm like, dang. I mean, they put millions of dollars into that park. Like, I just sold my one of my dear friends houses over there. Like, it's 215. This awesome little threebedroom, two two bath house, twocar garage like attached. Buy new construction for 300. Yeah, you can. Less than 300. There's new construction onx and east is all all in there. Um and you do have to be you know that's a big neighborhood and the further you go north typically it's um you get further away from the new cool stuff that's happening right. So like you need to know where to to buy there but I think that's a great neighborhood. Um and the last little maybe tidbit I'll I'll give um what I call the valley. I don't I don't know what that neighborhood is actually called. It's um Do you know what I do you know the little pocket I'm talking about? Yeah. We're talking about just west of Garfield Park and just north [clears throat] of like um Washington Street. Yeah, it's pretty far west of Garfield, but it's um it's not too it's like in the industrial area. Yeah, I helped a buyer over there. 200,000 got them a solid house, dude. Actually, I shouldn't say addresses, but it's just um it's just west of old Southside. It's right there, right? Yeah. Um, but yeah, like Eleno's got the thing going there. Like that's where the plans were to do the big soccer stadium and all that stuff. Again, like location I I I just think like with where our city is going, it would blow my mind if those areas did not 10x in value over the next five to seven years, right? It's like there's too much happening in those areas for the real estate in small pockets like that to not go bazooka and there might be Yeah. And there might be a ton of turbulence in the meantime, right? Like you might, you know, you might evict a tenant, right? Once every three years, right? You might um months. Yeah. Or every three months. Yeah. You might do a little bit in the short run, but yeah, I think over the long term those areas are Yeah. pretty special. So, pretty fire. Love that. I look at it from a primary buyer point of view, obviously. And so my perception is I'm buy my first home is on the near east side thinking west of 10th street man factory arts district you're next to Windsor Park Woodruff place the bottle works districts a mile like I'm still biased over there I think that is if you're looking for a place to be close to downtown for under 300 bang there you go that pocket you're talking about I think I took photos of that house that I mean if you're looking for longer term value I think you're right that's money where I'm at my favorite neighborhood There's actually a house for sale in my neighborhood right now for 300,000. Probably needs a solid 50k in work if I had to guess over time. But I bought my house, Delaware Trails is the neighborhood. Bought it for 250. And the long-term appreciation play being right next to Meridian Hills, right off of kind of that Kesler area, Crow's Nest, which has multi-million dollar homes just right next to us. We're surrounded by million-dollar homes. Unbelievable. um the pocket kind of a little closer to Holiday Park is more pricey. So that would price you out of 300, but that is maybe like a once you're ready to level up in that neighborhood where to go. But it's location, location, location. Like if you're willing to put some work into a place, that would be where I'd go. probably my my favorite success one of my favorite success stories favorite success stories [laughter] of a uh past client was a really cool couple. I met them on Instagram actually and they were looking for a house kind of in the broader-ish area. They bought close to where I live. They've put a ton of work into their house, but they got it for 280. It appreciated for or um appraised for like 300. I run running comps for them. Once they're finished, it's going to be well over 400. And it's just an absolute money play. It's nice that they're now like really good friends of mine. Um, but it that's that has been one of my favorite success stories. Like under 300, value is going to be well over 400 very soon. And it's just Yeah. Can I name drop one more neighborhood that's my favorite cheating? We're going to hit every My favorite is Cottage Home because So I live in Holy Cross just south of Cottage Home. Cottage Home is super cool cuz it's very intimate. There's probably 120 to 150 homes in that neighborhood. Their literal neighborhood signs are like doors that just say cottage home, like doors, like just sitting in the corners of the neighborhood that kind of segment it. They do a block party in October that's like this Halloween block party, which is amazing. We went last year and it feels like you're in Halloween Town. The the neighborhood owns a green space just on the north north side of uh the neighborhood that's like a little park. They've got like some fruit trees and stuff, like a little playground. Um, and they've got the walkability of that neighborhood is nuts. You are 5 minutes from Factory Arts District. You are right by Side Door Bagel. You can walk to Kingdom. You can go to, you know, Massav and in Bottle Works. You are You're probably paying over 300 for a house there. You might pay over 300. That's Do you want to My wife and I walked a house there three years ago like right in the 350s, but a few dilapidated homes that could [laughter] do some work. You can get If you partner with the right people, it's true. We can get you connected. Um no, I I just I love that neighborhood. It's so cool. Like the the gingerbread trim on the old style like character, literally cottage style homes. Um yeah, it's just super cool. And character like I was just looking into the Dorman Street saloon or whatever. I didn't even know this, but uh John Dillinger, like the guy that was like the big bank robber guy, uh I guess he may or may not have hung out at Dorman Street. That's cool. Because he had at the time in 1933 the biggest take of any heist in America. He stole $25,000 from Massav State Bank. Oh wow. And the getaway driver lived two blocks away from Dorman in Cottage Home. So that's sick local lore, but that's cool. When you live in a neighborhood that's got really cool stories and bank robber history, bank robber history, you've got a nice beautiful canopy of trees. Like literally when you're standing in that neighborhood, you don't feel like you're in like a downtown urban center and then you step out and you can see the skyline. So it's cool. Like you need Yeah, we should we should make Kyle the uh the agent of Cottage Home. He should be the only one listing and only the only one helping people buy. Um, yeah, I'll give give my opinion on the 300K. Unfortunately, I don't [clears throat] know if in Nora you can get something for 300. It would be kind of tight, but like Nora adjacent Delaware Trails, like I'll back Ian on that. Ian and I live in similar neighborhoods just on the opposite ends. And so where I'm at, I'm in like a pressure cooker of Fischers has to expand somewhere. Caramel has to expand somewhere, love it or hate it. and uh Meridian and Kesler and and um just the million-dollar mansions have to go somewhere. And so like Norah is just in the middle of a good Right. Yeah, it is. They just finished their high school renovation, too, which it looks beautiful over there. Like they're Nora is awesome. Like Washington Township Schools is going to be up and to the right. And so everywhere around is just so much nicer. And it feels like I'm living like I grew up in Avon, which is a not a small town, it's a bigger town. And I feel like I'm still living in Avon, living in Nora. It's been amazing. And the accessibility is uh fantastic. I would go since I have to play in the 300. I would go likely just west of Nora being like Pikeish area. There are new construction that you can buy around the 300. We're helping a guy do a Airbnb over there off 76th. It's like producing 80 grand a year. We're right between Zansville and Meridian Kesler. That one's fantastic. Good little pocket. Yeah, it's good to be surrounded by that. And that one was fixed up. I mean, they bought it for like 180 and now it's selling for 321 2 years later. Price in that neighborhood is probably like 275, way under 300. So, if you're a first- time home buyer and you want somewhere that's uh safe, I think the reliable schools would be a question like some things they've done with Pike I don't totally agree with, but could be a good option. Um, and the last cuz I have to go like I just am so passionate about the far east side and the plans that Lisk uh are doing and the community development of like P30 and modular housing on that side of our city. I'm I have to drive through it to get anywhere like just the way maps takes me. I go on the interstate to cut unfortunately cut this far east side in half. And I'm just like passionate about restoration there. And there are so many great people that uh have to commute outside of the far east side to work. So like a fun fact is 90% of the people that work in the far east side do not live in the far east side. So thus 90% of the people that live in the far east side are working outside of the far east side. Interesting. And like that is a major problem. We can't live, we can't work and play all in the same place. And so that's why you get like these um this underserved community feel that exists in the the far east side. So I'm just like passionate about pouring back into there. But you could spread 300 grand across like I don't know a whole portfolio of homes and really crush in that side. So maybe buy some dirt and start I mean the fact that we just named almost 10 neighborhoods in Indianapolis 300. Pick another big city that you can do that I No, you can't. I challenge you to find that in terms of living as well. Yeah. Yeah. I I'd be hard hardressed to find another city that's comparable to that. Yeah. I mean, we've been named on every single local or big national stage as like the number one most buyer friendly market, the number one this, the number one that. And it's like we're only number one because we're so affordable, which has a whole other bash of issues that we don't have to get into. But I I do like I want us to be the joy capital of the world. And unfortunately, I just don't know if we're there. Like I don't know if we are striving towards the right things as a city. Um, if you guys could change one thing in Indianapolis, what would it be? I'd put it on the coast on a beach. We're moving it. All right, cool. That's probably what I would do. Bring some water in. We could have had that like with I mean, we tried to have it with White River. We tried to just create the neighborhoods into the the coast here and and the great flood of Caramel and uh Oh, yeah. Caramel made Caramel just created their own. Is that where did they create that big old Well, that was because of the floods, too. like a conveniently a dam and a quarry filled up that like they're building a house around or building million-dollar houses. That was a very convenient thing that happened as a result of the floods. They had to move water somewhere. Got it. I didn't know anything about that. Get rid of I'd say get rid of the flock cameras. No data centers. Do we have flock cameras? Do we do we have flock cameras? All right. Right outside of our office. Yeah. It's really Sorry. What is that? Blackpool solar panel right above. You got the camera go's just watching you. Yeah, it's massive. You're simply horrible. You just get rid of that. Who approved? Exactly. Right. Nobody did. Nobody asked me. No one asked for this and yet it's here. Get rid of the data centers inside the city limits. That's absolutely absurd. Continue to focus on high quality level of actual development of whether it's, you know, I think the roads, everyone has problems with those, but whatever. that's that's a problem that can be addressed, whatever. But when we're when you're focusing on like, okay, how could our communities developed even within Indianapolis, what you touched upon, what you love so much about Cottage Home is like there's so much character there. I think that's a big piece of it, too, that you guys work with a lot more investors than I do. One of my favorite guys is Marcos, and he takes a lot of pride in maybe the margin's going to be less on this flip, but he's going to make sure that the quality of work and the uniqueness of the finish is there. And that's something that I think is really important for development whether it's a citywide thing or just on an investor to investor basis that's focused on like man the impact that you're having that that product that you're finishing goes beyond just the dollar that you make like really taking pride in that. And so I say that's a big piece of it too like how can we focus on whether it's a commercial development space. I mean we we're a big coffee shop people and like just the coffee culture here is fantastic. How can we how can that spread beyond just coffee shops, right? like how can these restaurants and other sort of commercial spaces have you know open seating? I think a cool thing that happened during co was when Massav and the circle were shut down and that was walkable. So cool man like that experience of walking and all these businesses just being in the street takes you kind of makes you feel like you're in Europe. Like there's a lot of that opportunity I think that Indianapolis has that is still to be tapped into. It's just how can we balance the need for greed, the need for more money versus the need for actual impact and quality of life. Like just because our GDP increases does not mean that that's a good thing. Like GDP is not the the gauge of success. It's the joy capital of the world. How are people living in the city? Those are the questions that should be asked by our leaders. And we should hold our leaders accountable to like, hey, do you actually care about us or do you care about your political career? That should be the gauge whether you're a Democrat or Republican or independent. It's how can we impact the people of our city and do what's best for them. Maybe you reach across the aisle and do something that's, you know, not what you're normally used to. But hey, if it's if it's helping Mojo down the street or helping a business have real impact, that's probably where we should spending a lot of focus. jump on that a little bit too cuz I think you're getting into something where Indianapolis has been moving in this direction but I think they can do more and they need to keep it up the trajectory. It's making it a city where you can have high walkability and like use of trails for biking and things like that. We've already seen it a little bit with Monan with Nickel Plate and it's shrinking trail is a huge the cultural trail shrinking the distance between the suburbs and the downtown space too. Like I would love to see a world where people go downtown again to hang out. You see this a little bit with this repurposing of of places like a bottle works or a factory arts or what they're going to do on Cole. Is it Cole Street or something? Yeah. And the Circle Center I forget. City Market, Yep. whatever they're calling that. There are a lot of cool opportunities, but the trajectory needs to stay in that direction because it's like where I live in Holy Cross. I can get on the Pacers bike share and be, you know, a a 10minute bike ride from most places downtown using places like or things like the Monon Trail, using things like the Cultural Trail. But the trajectory has to keep going in that in that direction to make it walkable. Dude, our founders have done a fantastic job of the fact that we're not on a major waterway. we shouldn't have existed all these things and that we're as successful as we are like our founders did an amazing job just making sure that that type of forethought is continuing and not just momentary profit momentary GDP increase like not sending money outside of where we're at but keeping things local and reinvesting into our people I think is a huge piece of that well I think people are so allergic to development because they you know in my backyard you can't go bring this new thing to life because it's going to ruin the character like Tyler and I just bought a commercial building and we've taken only heat on social media. Some love, some love from people that are in the neighborhood, but for all the wrong reasons, right? They're like, "Oh, that ugly thing is going to become beautiful again." And then the people that live in that quote unquote ugly thing, which is not that ugly, are like, "Oh my god, you're going to kick us out to make it all better?" It's like, "No, we're not. You can walk in shoe gum at the same time." Yeah. Literally. And so the conversations with the tenants that reside in the building that we're working in, it's like, "Hey, we're working on one unit right now. You're the next one up for lease. Would you stay in that unit to have yours refreshed? And here's what they're like as a result. Here's what it is. It's like a pent my grips. They come in, you know, on like uh W what is it? HTV. They come in and make these people's houses so much nicer. But you know what happens after HTV is done? There is now a refinanced loan that those contestants people on the show are paying for more. So like it's almost like that vibe. Every single tenant has gone, "Wait, I can have that live here and still walk to Patichu and pay that rent." Yeah. Yes. Oh, that's amazing. I work in the neighborhood. I live in the neighborhood. I play in the neighborhood. I want that. So, like bringing that back and I think that that this is just a redevelopment. This isn't even a new development, but having these uh there's stuff in like her Morton that would help tether different areas that have been proposed and neighbors are rioting over it. And it's like, yes, put those town homes with those that shopping center in that can become another pseudo uh garage out of nowhere or increasing like Tinker Street and making these different places better. It's like come on, we can we can actually you're also able to do that with your development because yes, the numbers have to work, but it's not a pure profit motive play, right? Like because it's impact because Tyler I mean because you're actually there it's not like the dollar has to make the most sense. It's like there there's impact behind it. there's real people behind it. More investors probably need to take that lead and make it happen. And one of the thing, you've hit on this twice now. There was Marcos with a margin and then living in your backyard doing a development. Like if you're out of state, you should not be going and attempting to renovate anything. If you want to park your money in a turnkey in one of those amazing neighborhoods that we listed for 300,000, great. We can help you do that. But your dollar like that's not the game anymore. Investment has changed in the last two years. The game now is to bet on a horse where you can actually invest dollars that are local that can squeeze margins differently or can have somebody directly that's on their team that does development or is the contractor or they have a a vendor that they're getting stuff cheaper because they're here and there's relational equity that goes into it. So like I can do more with my flips than you can from out of state and my flips are going to look way better. They're going to be way closer to what people actually and they're not going to cut corners. and they're going to pass inspections and so like you should find that guy to invest in. That is the game now. Real estate investing is not owning a business. It's not a get-richquick game as it once was. It's tighter. It's harder. And so what I found the smartest people doing is, hey, I want to go invest in that new development that's in Indianapolis or I want to go find that person that can help me flip or I want to go find that agent that wears both hats and can get a little bit scrappy here and there or get on the plane and grab a hammer. Like that's the alternative if you want to be in the the books that you're reading that were authored and written in 2016 where it was a completely different game and you could shoot fish in a barrel and you could win. Now you shoot that same bullet and 95% of those fish are big fat L's and there some of them are like uncashable L checks. Yeah, I'd love to hear your answer. All I was going to say is that like I think the only thing that's changed is that it's gotten a lot harder and a lot more expensive. And so if you want to make the shorter term impact play, right, the shorter term cash flow play or the shorter term like immediate I'm going to flip this to make this doing it alongside somebody who's local that knows what they're doing that can look at that bucket with 100 fish and know what fish to pick out. Like that's what you need to do to 100%. If you don't want to do that, that's fine. You just have to make a long-term play, right? which is buying the turnkey long-term rental in one of the neighborhoods that we just discussed and sitting on it for 10 or 12 years. Like, that's what the play is. There's no longer, okay, I'm just going to come in and make a 20 or 25% down payment on this single family home and expect it to cash flow $200 a month. Doesn't work that way anymore. So, yeah, the cash the cash flow doesn't exist. The upside appreciation is like you in real estate to to build true wealth, you have to make some sort of value out. That's why owning a home is so important because when you live in your home, you're going to love your home and you're going to change it looks like and you're going to love your neighborhood and you're going to want your neighborhood to be great. Like Ian posted the uh gifting his wife a surprise new faucet for their sink that like she's been doing dishes for the the past 5 years with this sink that she hates. And so he had that done while they were on vacation. It's like not only did he do that, but he also just increased the value of his home and the likelihood that it'll sell on the first day on market as opposed to the 100th day. And that's because he cares. He did that on accident. Like he didn't intentionally go increase value. He made his wife's life a little bit better. Like as a gift. Gotta increase Yeah. increase the the value of the asset that you own. It's pretty simple. Got to put money towards it. It's not free. Can we hear his answer on the Indianapolis? You're the one that didn't say the one thing that Indian What was it again? I don't even know. What would you change? I remember. Um the well I'll give two and the first one will be very short and it's very cliche but if if we could repave every road downtown tomorrow that that would by far and away be my first answer. Yeah we can roll the clip of Nate Spangle saying that he'll help Roots get on the back of the on the back of the truck and go fill up every single pothole and we can just go and we can put I I want to put like a lottery system on each of them. Let's go get that map that they've got and we'll just put them like bounties out on like what's the worst one and then we can just raise some dollars and go. That would be my first. You you bring up a really good point about this um this dynamic between downtown Indie and the suburbs. I think it's really uh interesting. I've all I've ever known is living on the west side of Indianapolis. Actually, well, I lived in Riverside for a couple years, so I I got a hint of what it was like to live downtown. But what I notice is that like the second I get outside of that loop, the feel that I get is different, right? There's this sort of like vibrancy downtown that you just feel no matter where you're at, whether it's Cottage Homes, whether it's Broadripple or, you know, Fountain Square, whatever. Each neighborhood has its own kind of like vibrancy and feel. And when I'm in Hendrickx County or uh I'm down south in those suburbs, I just don't get that same feel. And I wonder what it would take to kind of like mesh those two things together. Um, well, what do you like about each? What changes downtown? Well, I think what changes downtown is that there are just more kinds of people doing more kinds of things, right? It's like the suburbs feel very straightforward. Um, a lot of the same kinds of people doing the same kinds of things. Um, interested in the same things. cuz I think when you get downtown that frame of reference and that viewpoint just like expands much wider. Yeah. I would say whenever I would commute home from downtown I'm like watching people clock out from work and like clock into home and there's like this like commute and this you know car that has to be driven to get there to then go to the uh suburb land to then like clock out. And if you're not if it was almost like if you didn't have a kid, it was hard to engage in the community cuz like the kid is what gets you to the little league gets you to the like if you just show up at like the little league game as a 25 you're going to look a little creepy. Uh so you probably shouldn't do that. But you show up with your toddler and and now you're like into the community. But outside of that it's like it's hard to to connect. Well, that's exactly what it is though. Like you just said exactly what it is. It's like number one, what I think I enjoy a little bit about living in the suburbs is that it feels like I'm clocking out when I go home, right? Like I can like release myself from the hustle and the bustle and the vibrancy and the action and like this and that. And so I I enjoy that feeling like that that makes me feel great. But to your point, it's like to participate in the culture of an indie suburb right now outside of Carmel or Fischers or some of those higherend ones, you have to have a kid. like if your kid is not going to Brownsburg schools or Avon schools, you're sort of like out of it a little bit. Uh cuz you know outside of that, you know, there there's not much um not much else. Quick pause so I can give you some free game I normally only give to clients. When it comes to renovation projects in Indianapolis, House Construction has quickly become our go-to. House specializes in inspection repairs so that when you get a report that comes back loaded with a bunch of problems, they'll get you a quote fast with work that you can actually execute on. Click the link down below and we will connect you to house construction today. So, we just got to find you a kid basically, I guess. So, yeah, adoption. I don't know. Maybe you could figure something out there. Single dad life. Give more to the community. That would be so dope. He had a dog, which is a good start. Charlie's a good start, dude. Fun fact, I wanted to name my next kid Charlie. And I was like really really bought in on the name cuz my middle name is Charles. And then it dawned on me one day. I think I was talking to Trace and I was like, "No, Trent's dog's name is Charlie. I can't do that." I mean, you It's your middle name. I mean, you could make it work. Yeah, but like like it's Trent's. Like, we know how much Trent loves his dog. Like, it would kind of be sus if I was just like, "Ah, there's my kid." No, it's fine. We We've got a good backup. The Lord's provided a better name. Um, Indianapolis coffee. I know we've got two huge coffee buffs. Uh, I am definitely not I don't know how much you want to participate. I feel like it's hard to talk to these guys about it. So, you should go first. go first because I know you guys will be a little bit longer. Give me the hidden gym coffee spot in Indianapolis. Well, I'm not the right person to answer that question. Those guys would be, but I'm just going to go with Tempest. Like Tempest is one where like it's in my backyard. I could probably walk there and they have great coffee. Like I don't know what you guys thought, but I talk to town right now. Yeah, I enjoyed our time there. I thought they had a good pourover. Had a cappuccino and a couple of other things there that were really good. And the vibe is great. Um they're quick. Love it. We need more of that in the suburbs. We need more Tempest vibe in the suburbs that are like this downtown has such such a good coffee scene and then it's like cabin coffee which is like it's good. Serves it purpose. But the owner of that coffee shop would tell you that like that was a leap for him to make that jump there, right? Like he told us that been a really good conversation with him. Yeah. It's hard to find quality coffee in the suburbs, but it's nice to see that that's changing. I mean the amount of coffee shops that have been opening up in [clears throat] basically pick a pick a suburb and it's just starting to explode for why don't we open a coffee shop brother you're talking about mine but it's uh the same if you want to do it to make money then you probably shouldn't out yeah but like a passion project but if that was our we develop our office had a coffee shop out of the coffee shop I mean roots roots coffee co hey if you want vision casting I'm happy to do it down to chat that all day long I'm curious what you I think you're You want me to answer first? Yeah. I mean, I don't Okay. I've got like a top five in my brain of what's going to happen. These the top five indie coffee. It's like ask It's like asking someone what's your favorite movie or what's your favorite favorite music or song? It's like it depends on the vibe. So, like the day of the week is going to change. No, give us your top five. What am I going for? I don't want to give the whole top five. I will give one. I will give one. Um, and I will base it off of it being communitydriven. Rabbel is on the near east side. It is the most communitydriven coffee shop in Indianapolis because it matches the neighborhood that it's in. It feels like you It's a coffee shop that you could show up to once a month and they would know your name. Um, I go there probably at least once every other week at the very least. I like to pop around quite a bit. Um, that would be my number one. It's funny because we have talked to multiple owners just in the past couple of weeks of like, hey, what, you know, what's one or two places that we should go look at? Everyone says Ravvel. So, they're a great community coffee. They do have quality quality Joe. Um, I would say first, if you're into the coffee scene in Indianapolis, check out Indie Coffee Culture. It's a really cool Instagram page. I don't know who runs it, but they do a really good job. Uh, worth checking out pretty hot. [laughter] That's maybe subjective, but uh we are now we're we're attempting to go to as many coffee shops as possible. My favorite coffee shop, more for the vibe than the coffee, if I'm going to be honest, is Red Door Cafe. If you like unique, eclectic, cool character where you walk in, you feel like you're kind of portaling into a different dimension, that is by far my favorite place. But if you want quality coffee, throw a rock and you're going to hit good coffee. I mean, you talk about Amber, Helm, Commissary, there are so many quality coffee shops that literally compete on a national level where baristas are just becoming one or two in the nation. It's unbelievable. We just went to Coch. They have a new popup pourover shop Wednesdays through Sundays. Absolutely worth checking them out as well. It's hard to go wrong. And I think Indianapolis has the best coffee culture in the country and we're here to show that off. So, wow. Okay. I'm an idiot. I know nothing about coffee. What in the world is a pourover? That was a bad question to ask, guys. [laughter] Major major peanut allergy. Major milk allergy. Like coffee. Just it's black coffee. What am I supposed to drink? Just straight up black coffee. It's but like it's roasted right next to where the nuts are roasted. Like dead. No. No. They don't roast nuts in the same things coffee. They kind of do. A pourover might be your solution. Maybe pourover. Pour is just a high quality drip coffee. very it's usually like you're drinking this. It's usually like a single origin. You're going for a specific flavor profile. Um it's yeah it's it's you're you're going for getting the cleanest cup of pure black coffee that you can get so you can like have the tasting experience. But if you're not a connoisseur, if you don't really care, just get a drip coffee. It's also the cheaper route to go. I don't care because I don't know. So I think you need to take my coffee virginity. And I've never had a I've never had a drop of coffee in my life. Really? Okay. I've never had a a sip of coffee. I know that's or but like I would just like the cure egg at home like I'm going to have like the hazelnut and then like through. Right. So like I have to be sure that I'm not going to die. I just like it cuz I grew up my dad would wake up every morning, grind his little beans, put it on this little mocha pot on the stove and there was a smell that filled the house and he'd make my mom a really sweet one. His would be super hot and super dark. No cream or sugar. Like that's it. It brings every time I drink a cup of coffee, I'm back home as a little four-year-old and it's beautiful. So, you like the dark roast? I like a dark, powerful roast, not because it necessarily tastes the best, but it has the most memory attached to it. And I think coffee as a whole has the ability to put people in that mind space. A coffee shop has the ability to close off the rest of the world where you get lost in a moment, you get lost in a conversation or in the middle of your work and you just become part of the shop and part of that culture. And when we have almost 100 different shops in the Indianapolis metropolitan area that you can do that in at a high quality level, that's why [clears throat] India has the best coffee. I already told you you could take my virginity. You didn't have to romanticize [laughter] it. Sorry, I just passion though. Like for somebody like Maxelize. Somebody like [laughter] Max who like is not a coffee guy might like shy away from like the harsh like taste of coffee. Like I want to hear exactly where are you telling him to go and what are you telling him to order? I would say you don't even have to get coffee. Like I think I I would say the majority of women I'm drinking their water at this point. [laughter] I'm going to the vibe and drink. Exactly. And I could tell you which ones are filthy. You go somewhere because most people go to coffee shops really not. I mean I would say the coffee is great but it's goes for the vibes. Trent will go and order a latte literally not to look for four sips of it and he's like you know what I really I really like the vibe here. I really like the vibe here. And half the time I drink coffee, it's not because I need the caffeine or I I just really love the flavor profile. If I'm at Denny's, I'm getting coffee for the vibe, not because Denny's serves a phenomenal cup of coffee. Although crappy Diner Cup like type of coffee can sometimes hit. So Red Door Cafe, Caffeine Coffee. We're trying to say downtown. Caffeine is amazing. Those are just great atmospheres. You don't have to get a coffee. They have other options. They have teas and stuff and water coffee. Yeah. I mean, yeah, it's that's hard to say. Like, if you don't like coffee, it's it's inequality. Well, he doesn't know because it Okay, here's your the gateway drug to coffee is you start with iced number one. It needs to be probably Oh, milk. I can't even do that. Can you do like oat milk? I mean, they're just oat milk. If you can do oat milk, I would do a a mocha with oat milk, iced, something like that. It would trick you into getting into the coffee and then wean yourself from there. I can put some hair on my chest, boys. I'm not not scared to go straight. Yeah, if you're able. All right, then we're gonna make it happen. Give that a shot. That'll be our next our next episode with the boys will be at the coffee shop. Okay. Yeah, there we go. Straight and he'll step in like here you go. Take the rest. [laughter] I don't like it. No good. Crack. I don't like it. Oh god. I mean I Yeah. Bought my wife plenty of $8 cups of coffee. I can't understand the hype around the price, but maybe that'll give me some That is something we can agree upon. Yeah. Um, okay. I I've got two more rapid fire questions that I want to hit on. These have not been rapid fire at all, but number one, what is a habit that has absolutely just transformed your business? Um, for me, every single morning when I wake up, when I'm ready to clock into work, I get out my little digital pad and I write out every address that I'm working on, whether it's a pending transaction or an active listing or an upcoming listing. And that's how I uh do my task list is by address. And I've found that boy's out here balling. His task list has to be written by like transaction design. But um that that is how I can like stay organized. Yeah. No, I love that habit. Focused. I love seeing it. It pumps me up whenever I see his notebook. Like genuinely he does that every day. I do it every day. Like, oh, let's go. That one's coming. Mine's simple. Um every week I schedule one-on- ones with people who are doing business the way that I want to do business or people who I want to learn from and I surround myself with them. And the thinking is with time and proximity I will level up. So that's what I do. Uh and it's really simple and you know there's a lot of vicarious learning that's taking place because of that. Got to be a lifelong learner. You have to seek it. So you know right there's so many places that we can get education but going directly from a mentor that's and just people that you like to sharpen iron is so good. 94% of the country has a regular paycheck. only 6% of the country working population has some sort of sales commission payment. Um so being in this field it is you are required to have structure and I love trans mine's somewhat similar is I have to have a physical notepad with here is what I'm going to do today and I physically have to cross it off. Um, it really helps if you the roots system, the CRM, but my favorite piece is the action tracker when you can track what you are doing, the basic tasks, assigning points to those and like, oh, you know, I get to the end of the day and I'm like, I feel like I haven't done that much because as an agent, you can work all day long and make zero money. That is maybe one of the harder parts of the business. And so, when you work all day long, you don't feel like you've accomplished much. I'm like, I look at the action tracker. I put in my points. I've actually done double what I need to do. That has been really helpful for me to kind of stay grounded and rooted and like, hey, I can just like put my phone away and enjoy time with my kid this evening and not feel guilty about it. So, that's been a big piece of it. And writing it out on a physical piece of paper, I think is huge. For sure. Yeah. I'm just going to share because I never do. Uh, a habit of mine that I have that has absolutely leveled me up is getting out of the doing and into the thinking. It's like as much as I can, I'm trying to not go straight to the notepad and write down everything to do for the day. I'm going straight to my notebook and I'm writing out exactly like my vision for what is what what I'm chasing after right now. And I write that down 25 times over and over again. Just continue to write out the sentence. Um, and it just gets me fired into the right mindset to be thinking bigger and to uh be able to then bring that back to like systems and like making things better and then go into the action because if I just go straight to action, all of a sudden I'm just going to be doing action. I have to write my list the night before. If I wait until the day of, I'm in the boat of like I just get lost. Like it has to be the night before. If I get into the day and I'm already and then I'm trying to I don't know about you, Trent, but like if I try to make the list the day of I'm already missed. like it has to be done prior to give I think probably to give myself that space but I didn't even think of it like that until you said that but yeah that's yeah you have to be able to in and on the business at the same time yeah pseudo to that in in the journal has been I write down three wins from today and three wins for tomorrow every night and just let that brain just dream on what those wins are going to be like last night a huge win of mine is my wife and I went to Rooted together and we have never done Bible study together and we're engaged in this new program uh through traders and it's going to be awesome. I'm like so happy that we went and clocked in for it. And then today like this conversation like this is going to be the thing. And then I have dinner with a couple of the employees and their uh fiances tonight and I'm like I'm so excited for that connection and conversation. Just writing those out and making them a reality has been it's changed. It's made me dream about business in a way that uh you have to like romanticize what you're doing in a way to crush business. The second one that I have is what are you what are you ambitiously afraid of going after in the next three years in your own independent business, right? Like Roots is cool. It's a team under a brokerage that we're we're chasing after a dream of our own. But like each of these gentlemen have their own LLC's. They have their own entities. They are their own B. Like I don't get to I try to boss them around. They'll just look at me be like, "Bro, I'm like a 1099, right? I don't I don't I don't own them. I don't like that. That's a weird way to phrase it. Yeah, mine is chasing no debt. Um, I've made the very firm decision that that's um above purchasing any investment property or investing into any business or doing any other um money-making activity. My goal is before doing all of that to owe nobody any money. And so, it's something I'm excited about, but also a little little scared, too. What date would you have all your debt paid off? Um I don't have one. Yeah. I uh I try not to get into the business of trying to predict the future much anymore. I I typically don't do a very good job of it. So just take it day by day. Yeah. If you're doing like extra monthly payments and like target it by this date. No. Trying to get a one big old lump sum. Nice. Give it all to New Res all at one time. And the Reds will honestly hate that day because they're going to lose out on a lot of interest. But uh very true. It' be good for TK. Yeah. Um I think I have ambitions to make enough money to where my wife can stay at home uh and do the stay at home mom thing. Uh got a kid on the way next month, so super pumped about that. Um and so I think the fear comes from can I make enough money? Um, and then also just like I also just like have ambitions to like create multiple streams of revenue and do more than just a real estate business. Um, roots coffee cone. Yeah. And my brain goes so many different directions. And so I think the fear of mine is just like, you know, be able to make the right decisions, not try to take on too much because I can be the type of person that's like, "Oh yeah, I'll do this and I'll do this and I'll do this and I'll do this and I'll be a great husband and I'll be a great dad." And it's like the reality is you only have so many time so much time in a day. You only have so many uh available resources to you. So you have to pick and choose and you have to say no to things. Um so having the wisdom to be able to see clearly what the the correct path should be and maybe there isn't one direct path that's right, but you know in the direction of uh doing the right thing. So that's great. Yeah. I debtree I think it's biblical and I just think there's so much peace that can come from that um before I go any business ventures or anything like that and maybe pairing along with that in the personal business side of things getting to a point where I'm able to you know he mentioned earlier like being able to hand off someone to him to have him lead on something doing that at a bigger and bigger scale. um something about boats rising with water tides or something I know is a common theme on these podcasts so I figured I'd mention it common theme in my life baby [laughter] but I've realized if if I do if I do something that brings me gain like it should absolutely directly impact others in my life and so that's probably the biggest one of like how can I be debtree and how can my business positively impact others in the business or adjacent to the business I love that paying off debt, retiring wives. Your wife's crafty. She she won't Yeah, she'll be retiring. I mean, seriously, if you guys want to support Koff over here, you should look into his wife's pottery. It's sweet. And acquire some pieces because they are Khana Clay Works Hpatica Pottery Collective. Link in the description below. Yeah, of course. Popped it up. Um, yeah, I'll accidentally answer my own question. I don't really want to, but uh, thank you guys for answering and being vulnerable. To me, it's like how in the world does roots uh leave a confinement and become their its own thing that actually works, right? So, like that's the pseudo to it. We could become our own brokerage tomorrow if we wanted to and it has nothing to do with uh our partners because I love what we're doing at at properties and honestly it will be hard to leave them. I would rather just partner with them and become a larger part. Um, so maybe that's what happens in the future. But like it's terrifying to go, how do we break this maybe even out of Indianapolis into subm markets or maybe even out of Indiana. I don't know. But to me, it's like is bigger better or where do we go with it? Um, and just really expanding uh the the field here at Roots and and growing into a players. Like there are agents out there that we network with all the time that don't have a system. They remind me of when I met Tyler and they are uh strung out. there's way too much going on in their life and they're running to showing to showing to showing and like what lights me up is being able to meet with one of those individuals irregardless of if they're at roots or not and sitting down and like asking questions of have you ever thought about hiring an assistant? Have you ever thought about and just like helping them think bigger or have you ever thought about referring to a buyer agent expand the horizon and expand their their horizon into the the future of what life could look like with boundaries and still do this job and be amongst the 6% that are earning commissions because it's It's hard when you got to feed other mouths that aren't uh attached to you, aren't your kids, aren't your um wife and and doing that it's it's challenging. But that is what has shaped me as a business owner. It's like I want to feed as many people as possible. Um so it would either be that or or the second thing would be I want to make 10 people millionaires before I die. I don't know how that's going to happen, but that's what I want to do. You guys can volunteer. [laughter] I I'll take one for the team. It has to be me. And why it's rooted in that is because at some point in my journal, I'd be like, I want to become a millionaire by age 30 and like sick. Awesome, Max. Go chase that buddy and see where it gets you. Now I like it is way more missiondriven, way bigger. Uh and I I feel like God has just positioned me in a way to be able to share that abundance and to uh rise the tide of everybody around me. So, so that everybody grows. Uh, last question I have for you so we don't end on like such a weird deep note. It's just the boys. What is one thing just firing you up about in Indianapolis right now? So, so not something you would change, something that India is actually doing that you're like, "Wow, yep, we top dogs." Our sports scene is really exciting for me. Um, come on now. I'm a really big football guy, so like right now is like this is my time of the year. Well, I don't know if the Colts are going to be doesn't even matter though. I have JT on my fantasy team that matters. You'll be all right. Seriously, we are screwed. Yeah, maybe. Um, yeah, just the buzz around around the sports and and the teams and what's going on is something I'm really excited about. Yeah, Pacers are winning the ship. Like, there's no doubt in my mind they have the best team in the NBA and a lot of people will hate me on that, but the Indianapolis I feel like it's a really unpopular opinion. Oh, it's a very unpopular opinion. The fact that we have Caitlyn Clark, too, is kind of wild. Well, she's on the fever. Yeah, obviously, bro. But the fact that the city like it's Yeah, indie sports is kind of wild. That would be sick if she suited up. Um, I love the developments that continue to happen downtown. I can see it with my eyes as the skyline changes a little bit. Um, new hotels popping up, new redevelopments with City Market, as we mentioned downtown. They're going to redo uh Circle Center uh mall at some capacity. Not really sure what that all looks like. Um continuing to build out Factory Arts District and kind of doing these redevelopments. There's like an old women's prison on the east side, too, that's been open for redevelopment, too. Have no idea what that What was that? Randph. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, it's like I don't know what the restrictions are. there might be like a historic society thing with the buildings to where the buildings have to be maintained, but seeing what we've done with redevelopments of those types of spaces, I know someone will come in and do the right thing. Um, so just really excited for the trajectory and the the growth and development there. That's huge. I got to shout out Indie Parks, man. I I'm impressed with the amount of development that's happened with the parks across the city. I just think it's not appreciated enough. Like I just took my son to Tarkington Park. They had a really cool little splash pad. They've I just hosted a pickle ball event there last month. It's like brand new courts. It's beautiful. Really well-maintained. And then we went to I think it was called Andrew Chapman part in Butler Tarkington. Real hot day. Went to a splash pad. Like really nice spot. And I'm like when was the last time someone like actually gave them credit and like gave the city credit for that type of stuff? Even in areas where you wouldn't expect it sometimes. Exactly, dude. Like Tarkington Park's right off of 38th Street. Like no, I don't want to go there. Go there. Like check it out. Support your city, man. Like it's those are the types of things that make a real impact on people's lives. And like just because it's in an area that you may not think about going to. Like explore it. Explore the city. Check it out. I don't think you'd regret it. Yeah. We're all like ideiators obviously and want to create new things. And uh we we've been taking my son similar to how you guys go and see the coffee shops and and make posts about it which I love because I'm learning more about the city through that. Um we'll be at these parks with my son and I'm like so tempted to pull out my phone and just start recording cuz I'm like this is I didn't know this existed before I became a dad and like now I'm engag Whoa. What we played on as kids? These things they're like I don't even know how the kids supposed to scale that rock that is put in the middle of this place. We live next to Holiday Park. Holiday Park is their their new playground cost $6 million. Crazy. Lily Endowment dropped six mil. We threw a little bit of logs together and called it a park. It's crazy. It's really nice. I was like lucky if I didn't get tetanus three times like in one year and and now they have like it's like a cinder block slide at holiday party. like it's made the thing that this is made out of. I'm like that is a concussion waiting to have it. But I don't know what they're doing with parks. It's cool. It's cool to It's cool to play on them as a a 25year-old dad to go climb on all this stuff. Uh I'm most jacked about Indianapolis that we just continue to thrive as a community and culture that I can pick up the phone, I can call one person and get to the next person uh and just keep on climbing that ladder to like Kyle was talking about sitting down with mentors that are so abundant to say like here's how I got to on this podcast. We've had many of them uh on on this show and have just unlocked a lot of doors and been able to we've been a conduit to events and give a platform for people uh of that caliber to speak and just learn from them and continue to to grow. I don't think that's happening in many other places. Like somebody that has a net worth of unimaginable numbers to go, "Yeah, let me sit down and chat with you." Um and High School Hustle is a big piece of that. Like if you guys don't know what high school also is, they just moved into our workspace. But it's exactly that. It's like all of these They really moved into our workspace. They've been in our work space. Oh, I didn't even know that. Yeah. Uh the guys right next door. Um just shows how to figure out [laughter] the office. Trent's like, "What's the Wi-Fi password again?" Trent would change that. What's the door code? Um nope. We had to fire somebody, so we changed it. Anyways, so High School Hustle has like been able to to they're going to take the nation by storm and there'll be this massive opportunity. The winner this year like in the the summer months made more money than I did. Like the the kid literally cleared more money than our company did. It's insane. Out pressure washing and he's got like 10 employees working for him. And it's so cool to to I just wish when I was in high school that I had something in my city that was like, "Hey, you want to be you've been bitten by this entrepreneurial bug. here are the best entrepreneurs in the city. You can go learn from them. You can go be mentored by them and like yeah that little lawnmowing business that you want to do. Yeah, they can become a a massive multi-million dollar company. Like what are we talking about? These are high schoolers. So check them out if you're not familiar. This has been a lot of fun and has been even better than just sitting in the the dark scary studio to come chill on the couch, lean the shoulders back and have a good conversations. Thanks boys for joining on. And this has been another episode of the Roots Podcast. If you like this format, please let us know in the comments. You guys do not comment enough. We need you to comment more. Subscribe. All their information is going to be linked down below. Follow him on Instagram. Uh they are all putting out phenomenal content. It's my favorite to consume. Kyle's is the best. Kyle needs more love. 700 followers at the time of recording this. I want him to have 7,000 by the time the next one get on the couch. Please. Possible. Let's make it happen. Amen. Peace.