Stuck in a W2? This Teacher Used Indianapolis Real Estate to Break Free

living [music] and around the the city, we kind of see this massive boom happening. This is not the Indianapolis [music] I grew up in. There's a lot of transferable skills that came from teaching into agency. So, it wasn't like, oh, I got to reinvent the wheel and how I communicate and how I [music] educate and all that stuff. You bring up Indie to like anyone in the Midwest, they're like, oh, it's thriving. It's doing amazing. Everyone in Chicago [music] is moving here and wants to be here because it's easier to live here, too. More affordable as well. Welcome back to another Roots Podcast episode. I am Tyler Lingal and I'm here with my co-host Max Moore and we're here with our very own agent Kyle Hoffman. Kyle is a teacher turned real estate agent kind of similar to Tyler. He took the leap last fall full-time into agency and has just absolutely become like this rocket ship to the moon. Uh each month I'm just floored by the amount that Kyle is able to produce and and how many lives he's been able to change uh specifically in the first-time home buyer and house hack world. If you've house hacked with Roots in the last year, you've either worked with Trent or you worked with Kyle. And the odds of it being Trent are low compared to Kyle's stats. Dude is a house hack king. Um him and Ronaldo Lima at Approved Mortgage. I just group chat him. Boom. You're you're closing a house. If you end up in a group chat with Kyle Hoffman and Rnado Lima, you got a house. So without further ado, Kyle, welcome to the show. What's up? We start every show off with a quick planting roots. So, first question is, if you were an indie with 50K trying to start a real estate portfolio or just invest, what would you do with it? Yeah, if I were to I think restart, so I just bought my house this year, so um if I were to restart, I would probably go the house hack route. Um obviously I'm I'm married now, so kind of making that switch from going renting to to owning. uh we kind of wanted to have our separate space and so uh really weren't you know wanting to share walls anymore so just went the single family route. Um so I would probably do that or just put the 50k in my current home. I live in Holy Cross. Um and then kind of the the five-year plan would be to kind of convert that into an Airbnb. Have that kind of be the the first one of the portfolio. So yeah, I think that first house can be such an equity rocket ship. My first house created three rentals for me. Uh your first house created multiple rentals for you as well being that that gateway. So I love that just keeping it back where it's at. The house hack with a wife is like I have had one person ever successfully pull it off to get them on board and it was the wife leading the ship. Oh, there you go. And I think that's the only way it happens is if it's, you know, for the the girls out there, you guys have the advantage because you can just grab the guy by the neck and say, "Let's go. Send your wife this episode." Yeah. You have to. Mine's not I couldn't convert it. She was close. I mean, we we looked at one. I do remember one 425K in Fountain Square. She just thought it felt too modern. It was It was one of the uh I think it was Two Chicks and a Hammer did like the renovation renovation like you didn't buy theirs all sorts of stuff beneath the walls. [laughter] They're not They're not doing renovations anymore. They aren't doing renovations anymore. There were some good apples there. No, there was some good ones. No offense to two chicks. You [laughter] guys are awesome. Yeah, he's throwing shade. Throwing shade early in the episode. Um, yeah, I love that. 50K throwing it into your own investment to to skyrocket the life. Uh, house hack if you can. If you had one free billboard in Indie for a week, what would it say? That's a tough one. Um, [clears throat] Jesus is king. [laughter] Yeah, honestly, uh I probably wouldn't have it be centered around anything about myself or anything around real estate really. Um I don't even know how much that would really move the needle anyways. So, right. I don't know how many phone calls you're getting. Jesus is king. What uh what do you think somebody driving by 465 was the emotion that that comes out? They're just like if they see Jesus is king, uh it's probably uh one way or the other. [laughter] I think it's kind of polarizing, oddly enough. Um, I mean, he was a polarizing character in his day. You know, it was either on board with him or, you know, he have a different perspective on it. So, I think most influential people are pretty polarizing. Yeah. The the beauty of it in the marketing. So, anyone who's made a huge impact in the world had haters. Yeah. And sometimes they're Pharisees. Deep. Next question. I love it. Uh, if you could describe Indie in one word, what would it be? um undiscovered I would say. Um especially kind of just being in the Midwest. I mean there's a lot of people who don't even know where to point to on a map when maybe they've heard of it, right? I know like my wife when she moved up this way like she didn't know where Indiana was. She thought Chicago was a state. Um now maybe that's how common is that? I [laughter] don't know. It probably is. Maybe maybe that's something wrong with the the Texas education system, but I don't know. [laughter] Throw a major shade early on this podcast. But yeah, I think it's it's it's vastly undiscovered still. And I think, you know, for us who grew up going and living and around the the city, like for us, we we kind of see this massive boom happening. We're like, this is not the Indianapolis I grew up in, right? We're we're really, you know, put on the map. I mean, I was traveling a lot kind of the last four to six weeks and just seeing like Pat McAfee and his show popping off and seeing right behind him, what do we see? The Indianapolis skyline. It's like that's really cool to see like on ESPN every single day. Uh, so it's like, you know, we're making pretty big strides now, but I still think we're still kind of in the the early stages of, you know, what could happen. Is something undiscovered that you would like to call out? Yeah, I think in Indianapolis I think there's a lot of opportunities to um get out and you know visit new restaurants and stuff um in the downtown space. I think there's a lot of opportunities to get plugged in with um like interal sports. I think there's a lot of people who aren't doing that. I think CCA is is one that I early early got into. Um and you can kind of just network and connect with with people. Um, and then just I think there's a lot of entertainment options, too. I mean, we're we're kind of becoming a a sports mecca in a lot of in a lot of senses. We're like number one on every sport right now. We're on top. Yeah. Yeah. [clears throat] So, I think a post that shows like every sport. We're literally number one. Even women's basketball, you know, not number one. It's pretty crazy. Yeah. In the top five, right? We were top five. Yeah. So I think yeah it's it's one of those things where it's like just now I feel like we're we're kind of getting our our credit you know but Indiana is having a heyday I would say like right now it seems to be a really you bring up Indie to like anyone in the Midwest they're like oh it's thriving it's doing amazing everyone in Chicago is moving here and wants to be here because it's easier to live here too more affordable as well so I saw a post last week that was like uh the indie people think I live in it was like cornfields and you know probably out like how I live in Danville and then it was like the indie I actually live in. It was like Pacer game, Fever Game, IU game and just Indie 500 and all the great things that happened uh sporting wise and then all the connectivity and it was coffee shop and dinner and nightife and uh it's interesting to see a 5 mile like square radius become this this route in this uh uh just network king I feel. Yeah. And it's it's not going to be on the same level as like New York City. I mean you were just in right. It's It's funny from the plane. We like took off, had a perfect view of Manhattan. It was like shimmering in the sunrise. Came in to Indie and like the cloud the cloud blanket had settled and it was all snowy and I was like it looked really like depressing. But then got in and it was like settled in. I was like, I'd rather be here. Yeah. It's slower. It's more accessible. It's obviously more affordable. So you get, you know, a lot of the same amenities that you would get and experiences that you can get in, you know, big cities without, you know, having to deal with all the people and the high prices. So I think we're doing all the right things. Um, and I think that the connectivity, the inter mural sports you mentioned, I love how no matter what age from like 25 to 40, there's some sort of networking to go to for whatever you're into. And everybody's willing to share and like, you know, come play flag football with me. I'm like thinking about joining a flag football league. Like what? That doesn't make any sense for I play nose guard. Yeah. Something center. [laughter] I don't know how well I'll block. Um [snorts] there's a lot of people watching that are sitting right now at a W2 job thinking about how do I get out of this and have that entrepreneurial bug that's bit them. Um maybe they're, you know, just hitting their 30s like I need a life change. Tell me about the days getting licensed, jumping into real estate. Um, where' the excitement come the leap? So, I'll kind of rewind the clocks a little bit more. Um, the first thought that I even had of like getting out of a W2 job came from Tyler. We were like hanging out with friends. I think it was probably maybe 2022. I remember like you you had you know made the jump from going teaching into real estate and like I honestly didn't even know what to think. I was like I don't know what Tyler's doing. I don't he's going to be he's going to really struggle through this thing. I don't know about this real estate thing. [laughter] Like I I didn't know anything about real estate to be honest. I knew they made a 3% commission blah blah blah. I was like oh some of them can rake it in. Either way he kind of approaches me half jokingly like talking about like hey would you want to be a property manager? kind of like thrown out a feeler and I was like, I don't have any desire to [laughter] be the guy that gets called at 2 am from someone who has a, you know, a leaky toilet. Like I was like, that is not I'm not the guy for that. But I was like, okay, like maybe there's something there with like the agency side of things. So that was like the first kind of seed that was planted. Um, and then I think it was maybe six months later, seven months later, I was really thinking at this time I was a teacher. So I was teaching at Lawrence North High School at the time. I taught anatomy and physiology and I actually loved what I did. I was coaching basketball, coached baseball a little bit. I really enjoyed what I did. The problem was I was like, "Okay, if I want to start a family and provide for a family, I'm not going to be able to do that on a $50,000, you know, salary. It's not going to work. It's not going to work, right?" Um, so I was like, "Okay, either people are going to wise up and we're going to just say, "Yep, we're going to start paying teachers six figure salaries." Yeah. Or I was going to have to change something. So option one was, okay, I'm going to become a school administrator, athletic director, something like that. Option two was I'll go back to school and become a physician like a physician's assistant. And then option three was like, okay, maybe there's something with this real estate thing. So, uh, it was 2023 and I decided, okay, I have summer break. I can go to, you know, FC Tucker's, you know, four-week in-person training to, you know, get the license. Relatively low barrier of entry, right? Maybe you spend a couple grand to get licensed and everything. And I was like, "Okay, I can just give this a go and just kind of see what comes of it." Do it part-time for a year, you know, and and kind of see what happens there. Um, so, you know, got licensed. Um, I think I, you know, join I joined the brokerage at properties and then I joined the team pretty early on and I think probably for, you know, both your side and my side, it was kind of like see how this we'll see how this goes because like part-time agency sometimes we're still seeing how the roots go. [laughter] Yeah. cuz part-time agency like it just doesn't it doesn't work. Um, right. But it, you know, was allowed me a little bit of time to kind of, you know, see what a transaction looks like and all that. Um, yeah. So, first transaction, I think I went like active in October of 23. First transaction closed in like late February. Um, it was a a client from California. It was his first deal. It was my first deal. It was a $63,000 flip deal in Andrew. Let's go. [laughter] Let's go. When I got the commission check, it's it's so funny. Little 800 like $850 check. That was like the moment for me. I was like, "Wow." Like this is possible. I was Yeah, this is possible. I was like bit by like the entrepreneurial bug a little bit. And back then like we were very paycheck to paycheck. $850 was like kind of life-changing. I was like, "Okay, we got a little bit of breathing room, right? So then it was like, okay, how can I replicate that? And then going towards the end of the school year, I was like, I do not I do not want to teach another year because I want to be able to pursue this full-time. So had conversation with you guys, right? Um we're able to kind of figure out this listing coordination position, right? Helping you guys out getting getting your listings off the ground. Provided me a little bit of base pay, right? you know, just to have that safety net for the first Yeah. first couple months. And then honestly, just being able to be in deals every day and kind of support you guys is what really allowed me to get a lot of reps and to kind of go from there. It's cool cuz I think you just laid out a perfect blueprint for someone. Yeah. Which is like join a team, find mentors, and be of use to the team until you kind of get your wings and can fly. Right. cuz talk about where you're at now versus, you know, that that journey. I'm just curious. Yeah. Well, my whole mission was like I I needed to make myself so valuable to where you couldn't say we don't need you. [clears throat] In the beginning, I think we're like, "Hey, we've already trained a bunch of new agents cuz our bus was filled with new people that didn't produce." And then we were staring it down with you. We're like, "We just don't know if we have the capacity." I I was doing nothing for not doing nothing but I wasn't producing anything right when I was part-time. So then it was like okay I need to make myself extremely valuable in this new position. Um but yeah it's it was just a a a crazy you know exponential growth I think that happened. I I didn't expect it to happen as quick as it did. I was a little like um I don't know. Max has this way of talking where he'll say things that I think he knows 100% isn't true, but I believe him [laughter] and like I think but we both want to believe it. So, it's like when he first, you know, pitched the listening coordination thing, I was like, "Okay, I like the sound of it." But there's a little bit of skepticism there like, "Okay, is this going to work? Am I going to be able to do this?" And then lo and behold, it it worked better than I thought it could. So, uh it was really phenomenal. But it was like May of of last year. I'm I'm sitting here looking at Kyle who had managed to close a deal while still teaching a classroom through the week and like uh supporting your wife doing um her pottery and and going to uh things on the weekend to be able to sell those. And I'm like this guy is so busy and also still making it work and actually he closed a deal. And that's like the hardest thing to do. If you can close a deal, you can close a deal. Like let's just close deals. And uh I knew that I had a two-month runway because however school systems work nowadays, you get like eight weeks off in the summer. I can remember summers that we had like it felt like the whole year off by the end of it. Um I think that's the point to keep your your mind going. But I knew that I had eight weeks to prove to him that he could make a full-time income or double or triple or quintuple whatever he was making and you know leave benefits behind, leave everything behind and walk out the door. And I was staring that that's a beast to do. two months to change everything. I'm like, that's a short runway in real estate. You're talking like two to three years, right, for normal real estate runway. Yeah, absolutely. And by the end of it, I'm You had closed a couple deals over the summer, had a couple pending and I'm like, "Please don't go back to teaching and I think it was like the week of you put in your notice." It was I I gave him like three weeks, but it was definitely into July when I was like, "Okay, I think I'm going to just, you know, give this a go." Yes. What does your um like close friends and family think now that you're in real estate actually doing this? Like were they skeptical at first or Yeah, I mean people want to be supportive, right? Um there's a little bit of you know underlying like what's he doing? Like it seems like a big switch up which it is obviously going from WT similar to me they're like okay that's uh risky. Yeah. I think because I was joining a team, I think it helped a little bit and it was like by the time it came around where it was like no like there's a listing coordination position I'm doing so there's a little bit of base you know that gave people a little bit more ease. I don't know if it was like they I don't know if they they understood like exactly what goes into the job. So it's kind of like nobody on outside knows. They think we like fart around play on TikTok all day. Yeah. My my wife always jokes when she's like leaving for work in the morning, she's like, "Some of us have to work today." [laughter] No, same with my wife. I feel like when I get home and I'm like finishing call, she's like, "Time to watch your son." Like it's real work. [laughter] And I'm like, "I'm sorry. I just made us $10,000 today. Forgive me. No, [laughter] I'm not I'm not going to act." But it's like doing this work is better. Like, I'm not going to lie. It's It's way more fun. I can work at a coffee shop. Part of my [clears throat] job is incredible is talking with clients. That's fun. That's enjoyable for me, right? It's it's actually a huge blessing to be able to do a job that I enjoy doing and make more money doing, right? Some of us have to work today. That's so funny. But, I mean, it's just it, you know, it's kind of the the world we live in where it's the it's the difference of the W2 mentality versus, you know, kind of working for yourself, right? It's very freeing. And so, it allows me to go do a showing on a Saturday or on a Sunday, you know, if I want to, right? I'm making the decision as opposed to you have to be work at, you know, 8:20 today. We've got this meeting. You've got to do this, you know. So, right. But then on the flip side, the stat that I always remember is 80% attrition rate in two years. Yeah. And why is that? It's not because it's not fun. It's because it's a big responsibility to find where you're going to make your next month's rent or paycheck. I is hard. I also just think it's like it's it's not for everybody. Like there's jobs that fit you as like you know your personality type, your skills. Like it doesn't like for me there's a lot of transferable skills that came from teaching into agency. So it wasn't like oh I got to reinvent the wheel and how I communicate and how I educate and all that stuff. Like it was already there. It already fit kind of what I like to do and what I'm already good at. So realtors are educators. I feel the same way. I was like this is actually easier to educate because they're so bought into the bought in. They want to be there. It feels like I'm doing my job and actually getting paid and incentivized by the people on the other side is how I described it to people cuz I had my uncle. He's probably not going to listen to this. He was like, "Oh, I think it was better when you were a teacher." I'm like, "That was one of the most ignorant things I ever heard." But number one, because you don't know what it was like to be me, but then two, uh, I was like, "Actually, I am still educating." Yeah. On a broader scale now, I feel like having more impact. Yeah. You Yeah. And it's like you have influence in the classroom. you have influenced clients. It's totally it's two different things, two very worthy things. It's the same kind of like skill set that you're bringing to the table, right? Um, but yeah, it's I think it it very much boils down to there are jobs that fit us as people and when you're unhappy with your job, it's probably because there's something that that is better suited for you. And I think a lot of people get into real estate because it's glamorous in terms of like, oh well, you can just do these showings and you can make a lot of money. And so there's a lot of people that that's the draw, right? It's not actually like, oh, I want to have a positive impact on people and help them find their home. That's the pitch sometimes, but not everybody is, you know, being honest with that, right? And there is an opportunity to make a lot of money in real estate, especially as a Christian, I think. Yeah. And so it's like you got to have like some convictions behind what you're doing. And, you know, some people are going to be transactional about it. And I think those are the people that aren't going to be in the business for very long because, you know, us humans, we are very, you know, we we can read into that stuff and we can pick up that pretty easily. So I think in every single relationship that you approach, this is something I've been thinking on a lot, there is a transactional moment and a transformational moment or opportunity. So like every single human interaction we have, no matter if it's your parents, your you know siblings or uh wife or kids, you are going to be transactional with them. You want something from them. You want something from everybody and everybody wants something from you. The question becomes though, what transformation can you do as a result of that relationship? And the problem in our industry is that too many people approach relationships transactionally. Yeah. And they leave the transformation at the door. So you you get closed and uh unfortunately hopefully Logan's listening to this, like you know, we have a tenant situation going on with a house hacker where there's a tenant that renewed their lease well under contract. No knowledge to us, no knowledge to anybody on the transaction. and the property manager's autopilot did it and he's supposed to live there. Like he's supposed to live in the unit. It's a it's a like big problem. There's another unit he can move into and like we can sort things out and we're working through it. Um, however, in that moment, we could block his number and just be like, "Ha, sucks dude. Sorry that that happened to you." No. Hell no. We we are going to hold hand in hand and figure this thing out. It's a equation and problem that have to be solved and and it's a a relationship for a lifetime. And through those connections, like I know that that's been a transformative relationship and he's learned a ton and been educated by Kyle and his stewardship and uh I you know showings with me and and learning how to to break in. Yeah. I love those exposures of solving complicated problems. What you just said sparked something which is I remember working with a client named Jared. Maybe he'll listen to this, maybe not. And this was the first moment I thought, "Oh, Kyle's going to make it." Because I remember thinking he's in better hands with Kyle than me. Cuz at the beginning, I'm sure I was annoying you. Kind of helicoptering like, "Oh, let's make sure this doesn't go wrong." Kyle's like doing his thing in the group chats. Then I'm like, "No, no, no." And it's like Kyle's like, "No." Like he [laughter] probably already had it all worked out and I just come in and just like re chaos. But that it dawned on me like it was last spring that it was like actually he's got this and he's better with certain clients than I would be. Yeah. And I was like, that's when you know like you're coming into your own so to speak as an agent. Well, I think I think there's a transformation capacity in that, right? So like that's why so many people are transactional because you can have 100 transactional relationships because they're just a cycle in and out. It's harder to have 100 transformational relationships because they require energy, new client, new commitment, you know, more more time that they could call me with problem that I want to solve for them, right? it it becomes uh this mass load which is why we have a team. There are people to which I go yeah let's marry them with Kyle that's going to be this beautiful relationship that evolves that I couldn't do. I think that's what our team does exceptionally well is like get out of our own way and put you with who you're truly best with. Yeah. Just people having their niche and finding their niche. And I think like it it definitely takes some time. Um, I had a good conversation with a a now client um on Monday. Um, I I met with him a year ago and he reached out to me while I was on vacation in Hawaii. Just an email and I saw it come through. He wanted to he was going to be in town and wanted to schedule a meeting and it's like, "Yeah, absolutely." Just responded quick little email. Um, and in my conversation with him, it was kind of like I it was one of the first times I felt like I was interviewing my my future client in a way where I was just transparently saying, "Hey, here's how I operate and here's my specialties. Does that sound like something that works and aligns with what you're looking for?" Um, so, um, being able to kind of have that abundance mentality of like I don't need to lock this guy in and say, "Oh, I'm going to be able to do the best work. I'm the best agent in the city. Like there's a ton of other good agents too and you have a choice and if this is how you want to work, you know, that's not how I do it. This is how I do it. How's that work? You know, so just being, you know, transparent with that, too. And so I think, yeah, one of the things that our team is as we grow, right, we're getting different personalities. We have different, you know, different niches that we're carving out. I think that's one thing that we can kind of service our clients best and say, "Yeah, where do we see you best fit?" Right. So yeah, and and [snorts] I think anybody that's sitting on the fence going, man, 2025 has been a hard year. My W2 feels stalier than ever. I love what I do. I'm passionate about it and I feel called, you know, spiritually to be here. But there is something that has been in the, you know, stirring up and and you want to take a leap. Like come have a conversation with somebody like Kyle and and hear his story out and and allow him to interview you interview you to a sense to say like, do you actually want to take this leap? and this is what it looks like and these are some of the anxiety points that that hit. Um yeah, I would encourage anybody to trial that like the age of this generation is to not get stuck because if you get stuck in one W2, you ain't they they're not taking care of you. I mean it's just there's no pensions and things like that that exist. My dad was giving like his life story to this group of like 50 or 60 people and I was in the room and he said when he became an entrepreneur, he was 45 and he was making $400,000 a year. And my mom looked at him and was like, "You're crazy. Tyler's going to college. Our bankroll like is higher than ever." And he was like, "If I don't do it," he to he told her, he's like, "If I don't do it now, I will never." Because like if you're making half a million dollars a year salary, like that's the most addicting thing ever. It's handcuffs. The golden handcuffs, right? But he did it and wound up uh being way more fulfilled, but also making way more money. Yeah. Doesn't always turn out that way, let's be honest. But for him, it did because he trusted that that calling really to step into that. And for some people, it might happen in your 40s or 50s, which is wild. I'm glad it didn't happen for me or us that way. Yeah. But everyone's on their own path, right? Yeah. Yeah. And it's I mean, it's it's audacious. It's intimidating. It's it's not easy to do. It's not easy to take that leap. Um so I commend you for that. Before we let you go, we always wrap up with a segment that we like to call taking root. It's a few questions, some indie based, some spiritualbased. Um, that is probably the best part of the show and we should just start there and end there and and we'd have millions of views. Uh, you want to hit first question? Yeah. Favorite brunch spot. Favorite brunch spot. I mean, this one's probably kind of cliche. Um, but like Cafe Pachu is is probably it. Uh, specifically the one at the Sts cuz it's got the best vibes in there. Um, yeah. It sounds so cliche, but like it is a very good staple. Um, what what do you get on the menu? Uh, the Cuban breakfast was kind of my my go-to, but the the chilles are also really good. So, the cinnamon toast. Yeah, the cinnamon toast. The cinnamon toast. Throw that in as a little extra. Yeah, the studs is unknown, but really solid spot. Yeah, it's it's the only Cafe Pachu location I have food limitations. I'm allergic to milk and nuts. And they actually do a fantastic job with that. Their alternative is like a fruit bowl. So it's like not fulfilling enough. Uh dude, you don't want melon for breakfast. I need a little bit more. I need I need some more. Tyler loves booking meetings there. And I just sit I used to book every like meeting at Cafe Pachu. Spent ungodly amount of money. [laughter] But Max would like not eat [clears throat] anything. Cup water. I can't have anything. some ice chips, please. Like, so we stopped booking. I was like, if you want the food, just go to the studs and I can eat cuz they have a lunch menu. Many options at the garage. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, what's one habit that changed your life? Um, I think working out regularly. Um, and this started in college. I actually had a a workout buddy who I I lost a bet to him doing this, but I was like in this weird auxiliary gym that had like all the the free weights and stuff and I saw this dude. He was like an ROC looking guy. Turns out he wasn't an ROC at all. Most disciplined dude, Josh Wear, that was his name. Shout out. Um he would work out six days a week for like an hour and a half to an hour and a half to two hours just depending on the day. And I went up to him. He was like, "Built, I was very skinny at the time." And I was like, "I need to I need to hit the weights." And so I I made a bet with him that I would work out with him every day for like a two week stretch and if I didn't, I'd buy him like Subway or something. Ended up losing the bet, but stuck with it after that. And like he really kind of provided the accountability to like, "Hey, you're going to be here at this time and we're going to, you know, get our work in." And I did that for all of college. And it really kind of set the foundation for like, hey, you need to have some sort of like daily rhythm and have some some discipline in what you do. Um, and now I kind of adopt that same mentality into, you know, doing other things, whether it's reading or um, you know, prayer, whatever. You know, I I think it's funny because I remember Josh um, he was Yeah, this dude had ungodly amounts of discipline. Uh, huge biceps just like ripped out of his mind. But my brother and I would work out a lot of times at in the afternoons at the same time. Yeah. And we would come in, hit the bench press, like do some curls and like leave in like 30 minutes and like they would stay there four times the amount of time. I was like I would even joke at Kyle like, "Oh man, you got an hour left like dripping in sweat." It was crazy. [laughter] There were days I did not want to Saturday morning lifts 8:00 a. m. we'd be in there for 2 hours. I hated it, man. I hated it. like it it's the it's it was the feeling afterwards though. You're like, "Okay, I'm accomplished. I I did something hard today." So, um yeah. Last question for you. Uh what is an area of your life you're focused on growing right now? I think right now I'm I'm just really trying to kind of along the same the same lines there. Um just double down on my own discipline uh to to hold myself accountable to my daily and weekly rhythms. Um, I'm still kind of in this phase of like I want to build something. Um, you know, I want to, you know, influence people in in the most positive way and steward what I've been given. And I feel like I'm not, you know, kind of hitting the mark with, you know, my time, my my finances, things like that. So, I think just, you know, really getting more dialed in uh to to steward the the good things that I've been given because I've been extremely blessed. um you know in in more ways than I can count and I I don't want to make I don't want to squander that. So that's something I'm I'm always trying to be more focused on. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. I encourage you and and we'll hold you accountable to it. Last question. If our audience is looking for you, where can they find you? Um [sighs] well, I'm in and around downtown all the time popping around at different coffee shops. Um yeah, that's that's usually where I'm at. Um, if I'm not there, I'm, you know, hanging out playing soccer at ungodly hours on Monday nights. So, we've done a lot of ungodly stuff in this episode. We used that word like five times. My brain's not firing all cylinders. I just That was the word that came to mind. If you're at Grand Park and you see Kyle in a Roots jersey, go up and say hi and strike a conversation. Good branding on those kids, dude. I remember like there was a season where you were playing like five in numero sports and every night I feel like you had a game. There were times I think we were up to like four nights a week or something. I was doing like sand volleyball and then like three nights of soccer and then yeah Crystal was like you got to you got to dial down on that one. [laughter] It's not college anymore. I was like literally signed up for a Thursday night league and then she just was like gave me a look and I was like all right I'll I'll drop out. I'll drop out. Keep us in check. You can't Yeah, you can't be doing too much. We are going to be doing the roots flag football though. We will be we'll make we'll carve out some time. This has been another episode of the Roots Podcast. Drop a like, comment, visit us at roots reality. co and sign up to one of our events and come out to uh our next master class should be spring of 2026. We'll see you there. Peace.